Reverend Dean Becker: (00:00)
Those who believe in drug war, do not believe in public safety because of law enforcement's stubborn belief in this policy. Criminals around the world make hundreds of billions of dollars each year selling ever more deadly and contaminated substances. I am Dean Becker, the Reverend most high broadcasting and standing upon moral high ground. Hello, my friends. Thank you for being with us on this edition of Moral High Ground. I am Dean Becker, the Reverend Most High. I appreciate you being with us. We have a show today that's, uh, that's gonna set a record for the most guests on one program that we've ever had. Uh, we have with us today. Uh, Chris Conrad and his wife Mickey Norris. Um, authors, activists, uh, uh, people that have been at this for decades. On end, we have a regular Mr. Phil Smith of, uh, stop the Drug War. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (01:00)
He's going to join us as well. And we have Lauren Mendelson. She of, uh, well, an expert in California, works with California normal and many others in smoothing things into the future. And, uh, there's a chance we're going to have another guest if he shows up. Uh, Mr. Chris Bennett, the Canadian activist and author. But, uh, I wanna open with my, my thoughts. I've determined over the years that the biggest gang in America is law enforcement, the police, the sheriffs, the constables, and the prosecutors. It's a brotherhood, a brotherhood of mutual absolution of tyranny and pretend paranoia, paranoid delusion, uh, just a gathering of often fools and idiots. They're all prophet from domineering over the rest of the population. It gives them this little prince or princess perspective, a pretense of being lords of society, feeling that they have subjects us to be governed. Uh, with that, I want to go ahead and, and we're gonna have a diverse, uh, set of topics today as well, uh, the past, the future, and what may be. But I want to talk about a story that breaks all too often, police getting confused, getting numbers and addresses mixed up, getting, uh, I don't know, just headed in the wrong direction. And Chris Conrad has a story about a 16-year-old who suffered from that set of circumstances. You wanna tell us about that, Chris? 

Chris Conrad: (02:27)
Yeah, sure. Uh, and thanks for having me on, Dean. Uh, yeah. This particular incident is coming back to the forest. It's actually from 2023, but, uh, the reason that it's coming to the forest is because, uh, the family has, uh, of a guy named Randall Sison has, uh, filed for a no-knock, um, excuse me, for a, uh, wrongful death suit against Alabama Police and Mobil for, uh, shooting, uh, the young. He was a teenager. He was asleep. Uh, there was a no knock raid. They smashed in the door. When he heard the door getting smashed, he grabbed the gun. Uh, everyone agrees on that point. He also, as soon as he saw it was the police, he, he dropped the gun and raised his hands. Everyone agrees on that point. Uh, then the police shot him four times in the chest and killed him. And so, uh, there's video showing that that was the case. 

Chris Conrad: (03:16)
And, uh, basically, uh, now finally, the family has decided to pursue this in the, uh, civil course to get some, uh, relief from what happened there. And, uh, this has just been a pattern according to the Miami Herald and the Associate Press. They both mentioned that this is a, there had been at least four similar shootings, uh, in the mobile area of law enforcement. And in these cases, it seems like that they don't end up going to prison for criminal charges. They, uh, wait till the family sues for civil case, uh, a civil matter. And so that, that's really the story in a nutshell, that, you know, finally, uh, a year later, a year, a little over a year later, the family decided that it had to take Madison in his own hand and try to get some justice for this young man who was killed. 

Chris Conrad: (03:58)
And, uh, like I say, the, the interesting thing with it was, is that the police were after his brother who did not live at the house. And so it wasn't like a wrong address where they just got the wrong address. They took his name and they knew his family lived, and they went after the family. Uh, even though the, uh, the alleged drug dealer, uh, was not there, of course, we don't know if the drug dealer had any drugs at the time because the police were busy shooting his brother to a different location. So they didn't seize any drugs. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (04:25)
And again, this, this underscores my thought, mutual absolution and just delaying the, uh, the consequences for the police are the, the ones who get it wrong. Uh, um, Phil mentioned in our earlier discussion that, yeah, they get a year's vacation while they're waiting for the video to be released. And, and for the, the prosecutor to, you know, pad the, the, uh, witnesses to, uh, in their favor. I, anyone else wanna respond to that? Please? 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (04:53)
You're a paid vacation, usually. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (04:55)
Yes. Yeah. Oh, yeah. No, that's, that's true. 

Chris Conrad: (04:58)
I, I would just wanna say right off the back, thank you Phil Smith for your, uh, ongoing series of reports on law enforcement, uh, violence and brutality, and, uh, you know, what's going on there? Because I think you're one of the, you're keeping one of the best, uh, lists over there that's out on the drug War Chronicle 

Reverend Dean Becker: (05:14)
Keeps us busy. 

Chris Conrad: (05:17)
, unfortunately, yes. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (05:19)
Yeah. That, that is the problem. That it's, it's not that it's not a rare occurrence. Uh, it is the whole point. It, it probably happens, uh, every day in, uh, in America to some degree. Maybe not four bullets to the chest, but wrong address, wrong arrests, et cetera. Right. 

Chris Conrad: (05:35)
It's also worth noting it, urban area and a young black man. This seems to be another part of the typical profile. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (05:43)
Norris, go ahead, please. 

Mikki Norris: (05:45)
Yeah, I think the problem really is the policy of no-knock search warrants. I mean, that needs to, to end. They, they've ended in lots of tragedies. One of the most, uh, notable ones was Breonna Taylor, for example, in Kentucky, who was shot in 2020. They went to the wrong address. Her, her boyfriend, uh, with, they're awakened in the middle of the night. And, you know, here's these strangers coming in and starting, you know, to shoot at them and they shoot back. So, what, you know, the, it's a, it's a terrible policy. And she also really did not get the justice that, that she deserved. I don't think the cops were held that, uh, responsible at least criminally, I think civilly. They might have had a payout to her, but it was, it was terrible. And these, these go way back. And we had in our book, shattered Lives Portraits from America's Drug War. 

Mikki Norris: (06:43)
We highlighted the story of Donald Scott, and where they wanted, um, I think the state or, or the Park Service wanted his property down in Southern California. And they used the pretense of him growing marijuana on his property. And they came in also in, you know, early morning meal, you know, guns blazing. And he was killed as a result of that. And that was a matter of them wanting his property. So this policy of no-knock search warrants, I think is really probably unconstitutional. You might know that, Lauren. I mean, is it, I mean, is it a violation of our Fourth Amendment rights as well? 

Chris Conrad: (07:28)
Yeah. I just wanna throw in also that the, the, um, Randall was shot at five 30 in the morning, and likewise, Donald Scott was, uh, it was like dawn when they did the raid. So they do these raids when people are asleep, and yet they come in like they're, they're hitting, uh, you know, invading, uh, another country or something with all the weaponry. I'm sorry, 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (07:47)
Go ahead. Right. And they, they ought to be, uh, unconstitutional legal. I feel like they, in my opinion, they, they violate the constitution, however, thus far, they've, you know, withheld and stood up against these legal challenges. So that doesn't mean there won't be a situation someday that's so egregious that, um, you know, we might set some new precedent there. But it really is, uh, you know, is the government really achieving its, uh, the objectives of public safety, uh, and getting this, uh, you know, control of the situation? I, I would, I would disagree strongly based on these multiple tragedies that continue to happen. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (08:28)
Uh, Phil, Phil Smith. 

Phil Smith: (08:30)
Yeah. A matter of public safety. Uh, that's one reason why we wanna legalize drugs, because every mm-hmm . Potential interaction with a law enforcement officer endangers the safety of the public. Yeah, you might end up dead, uh, but if, if legal or other drugs are legal, they have no reason to interact with you. Mm-hmm . That saves lives 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (08:53)
Absolutely frees up their resources and time to, to, you know, really focus on legitimate crimes, save taxpayer dollars. Um, there's mind blowing that we're still in this situation to me, 

Chris Conrad: (09:07)
And, and it doesn't end when they go to jail when you're in prison, because we have like a several cases where a prison guards are beating people to death and things like that. Right. There's a new case that's been well uncovered. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (09:18)
That's, that's a story I I wanted to cover. A very recent story, um, happened this month. Uh, a gentleman was in prison for, um, I think some years, and I don't know why this situation occurred, but apparently this prisoner was taken to, looks like an infirmary. And there a gang of New York officers pummeled the man severely kicked him in the groin, ground their foot into his groin, beat him so hard that he died the next day. Uh, and, uh, I think 11 and perhaps as many as 15 officers have now been dismissed from that, uh, that force. And it, it's, again, this idea that we, under their control are deserving of abuse, of punishment, of, you know, chastisement of making us change our ways. That's where the, the, uh, the law enforcement has just tried to gather this, this, this club, this means to, to control us. And if, if you give them any objections, they're, they, they're willing to kill you. Uh, please respond to that one, folks. 

Chris Conrad: (10:31)
Well, one of the things in that particular case that I believe that the medical staff helped to cover up the incident is one of the reasons it took long to find out what had happened there, because the medical staff was supposed to be helping him out the, the victim, but instead of that, they worked to cover up for the police. And so some of the medical staff have been fired as well. Whether they're charged or not remains be seen. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (10:51)
Right. And, uh, it's, well, and again, the long justice for these cops, whereas if you or me, we would already be behind bars if we had done something similar. Uh, I see that Chris Bennett has joined us. Uh, now we have our first international, uh, panel as well. Thank you, Chris. How you doing? Uh, your audio not working, not working on 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (11:14)
Mute. 

Chris Bennett: (11:15)
Oh, uh, how about now? There you go. Yeah. Good, good. Okay. Sorry for being late. Uh, I feel really bad. I nodded off there, . 

Reverend Dean Becker: (11:22)
Well, it's still holidays. You're allowed. Yeah. . No, that, that's good. Uh, Chris, um, I, I saw, um, uh, a piece you had released, a gentleman had written up there that really just, uh, chastised the US government that just showed that we're, we are the bullies, and that, uh, we're way off track. I, I, well, 

Chris Bennett: (11:43)
It's the first time, you know, that Canadians had had to really consider being annexed by America, you know, under, uh, under under Trump. And he's not even president yet, along with a Panama Canal and, uh, Greenland, you know, so, uh, it, it's, it's looking really scary from here in the USA where we're gonna, we're wondering what's gonna happen January 20th, you know, when 13 to 20 million, uh, immigrants are pushed to the borders and, uh, uh, forced to look for new places to live, you know? And, uh, what, what's that gonna do to the American economy? What's that gonna do to the Canadian economy? Uh, um, it's a time of unstability worldwide. Trump has unstabilized nato, he is unstabilized the world situation. And, uh, who knows what 2020 five's gonna look like. 

Chris Conrad: (12:30)
On the bright side, though, I think that what you're finding, Trump is just saying those things so that the media stops talking about his nominees. Uh, you know, this is, I I, I don't think he really intends to do any of that stuff. I think that it's just the, the usual, uh, dog whistle to the media is like, oh, you're focusing too much on, on facts. That's gonna, some hypothetical thing to di you know, uh, here's a squirrel over here, 

Chris Bennett: (12:50)
. Yeah. It destabilized things here, though, you know, regardless of that, it's, uh, uh, the caused an early election, uh, um, and, uh, the, the, the right-wing government of the conservatives under Pierre Pulver are taking advantage of that and pushing for a new election. He lost his, uh, finance minister over it. Uh, um, so it's, it's successfully destabilize things. And it's, uh, uh, um, so that, that type of talk, you know, it's like you can't write off presidential talk as, oh, he is just joking around. He's just saying thing. And I think that what that does is normalize his behavior. You know, uh, um, we don't know what Trump's gonna do. I don't think he's gonna, you know, we're too white to invade. So, uh, um, it's not gonna be like that. But, uh, you know, uh, there's well-known Canadian meeting with, uh, the Trump White House right now talking further about, uh, uh, making us become the 51st state. 

Chris Bennett: (13:39)
So there's definitely, you know, true through Jess, he didn't just do it once. This has been multiple times now. Uh, um, and, uh, um, you know, the situation in Ukraine and Russia as well, uh, um, you know, he's totally, totally flipped the thing. It's like, we don't know what's gonna happen, and the people that he has hired and his cabinet are, are loony loyalists, uh, uh, and extremists. So, yeah, I don't think it can be written off, uh, purely as, uh, you know, it's definitely gone from cheaper bread and eggs to, let's take over Canada, and Greenland and the Panama Canal pretty quick. You know, it's taking, taking the talk away from some things. And, but I think there's more to it than that, 

Reverend Dean Becker: (14:18)
Right? Uh, clearly 

Chris Conrad: (14:19)
Part of his overall platform, like, for example, I was reading in the paper today, they said that people aren't as worried about inflation as they were three weeks ago, when the new news media was talking about every minute of every day, and polling people constantly about it and so forth. Now that Trump's doing this stuff, people aren't thinking about inflation because, you know, they're thinking about invading Canada, how, how nice the state that would be for us. But I do agree with you. You can't, he's, there's no telling what he will actually do. 

Chris Bennett: (14:42)
Yeah. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (14:43)
Chris, I, I was gonna say, I, I opened up this discussion with the thought that there is this mutual absolution society with the cops, the prosecutors, even the judges, and the politicians, uh, that, uh, forgives mistakes. Um, some not so minor by cops, by, uh, even prosecutors doing their job, as long as there's this quote, moral sense that it's for the right reason, whether it's legal or not. And, uh, I, I think we, we have a very, well, uh, maybe not similar, but the situation with these goons that Trump is trying to hire on as his helpers, uh, that many of them have criminal records, have been very deviant, um, members of society. And yet through this, uh, Christian nationalist movement, they can be forgiven. They can be allowed to move forward and, and to take control despite their prior sins. And I, I just feel that, um, you know, that's, that's just, uh, leading us in the wrong direction. Anyone want to comment on that? 

Chris Bennett: (15:48)
Well, I think Trump's kind of like the peak of all that . He's like the ultimate felon. 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (15:54)
Yeah. Yeah. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (15:55)
No, 

Chris Conrad: (15:57)
I, I would have to say that when you look at somebody like Matt Gaetz, uh, who is being proposed for the Attorney General, and yet you've got, you know, he is a pedophile, you know, basic a, a, a sexual predator and a peau file, and yet Trump wants to put him in there. I mean, the one good thing about it's, he favored legalized marijuana , unlike the person who's replacing him and so forth. But I was just reading that in his, uh, home district, he's popular, has gone up since the release of that report detailing his pedophilia and, uh, and, and prostitution and drug use and all that stuff. And, uh, they're saying, 'cause it is like they, they feel like if you say something bad about one of their guys, that's political. Uh, but if it comes to anybody else, then of course, then they should get the full extent of the law levied on them. 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (16:44)
That's a big difference 

Chris Bennett: (16:45)
Between the left, you know, like we're always capitalizing our people and, uh, uh, criticizing them and stuff like that. So it ends up just being a double down on the left, because the right's, so, uh, reluctant to do any sort of criticizing of their own people. Mm-hmm 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (17:00)
. And I was very, you know, I'm very concerned by, uh, the normalization of this, uh, lack of integrity, I suppose. Lack of compassion, uh, hatred, um, quite frankly is, is what it is. Um, and, uh, a lack of empathy as a young person. I'm shocked by how many young people support these ideas. You know, I think it's, uh, we tend to think that maybe, you know, the older generation is more stuck in their ways and less open to new ideas. But, you know, I've, I know a lot of young people that are supporting this, uh, you know, Donald Trump and, and, and his cronies, and this, this rhetoric of, of hate, uh, quite frankly. And, and it's, um, and if the, you know, the only justification seems to be economic, I think, uh, and or, you know, they wanna be an too, and they feel that they can do it because that's how the president's behaving. 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (18:00)
And I, I'm deeply troubled by that sense, you know, across our country. And I think some of us can get in our very, um, you know, progressive bubbles, um, in the Bay Area. And I surround myself with folks in the left, and, and the whole state of California is relatively progressive, but if you go to the rest of the country, I was on a, a road trip earlier this year, right before the election. And, um, it is, it is very different out there. And, and I think that there's, um, we need more people getting together. Uh, and maybe not talking politics, but just, you know, getting together and having a meal and, and reconnecting as humans, because we've kind of lost the ability to respectfully disagree with our neighbors, um, and to have rational discussions that aren't, you know, driven by emotion, at least kind of on, on the right. Um, so, you know, and so I, I, I've just, you know, as many people have been just kind of very depressed since the election, you know, the first time it was a mistake. I understand electing him once when we didn't really know what he was gonna do, but to then have him get, you know, impeached, have him get convicted of all those, you know, various different crimes, uh, and then to elect him again, it's, uh, that's on us America. That's, it speaks to some, you know, very deep sickness that we've gotta reckon with, 

Chris Conrad: (19:17)
You know, a couple things there. Say something. Yeah, I, I, I was saying that, uh, I know that there's, in the medical field, there've been a real decline in the number of people who want to get involved in medicine since Trump did his war on science, uh, with the first term in office. I'm just wondering me, Lauren, what do you think? How is this affecting people's interest in being attorneys, or, or what kind of people are gonna wanna be attorneys in a situation where it seems to be like maybe bribery is gonna be the main ex mm-hmm . Uh, substituted in place of justice. We might just have, you know, crony, bribery, uh, running the course. 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (19:48)
Yeah, I mean, I think that, you know, I could see it both ways. I could see how some people are gonna be motivated to try to get, become, you know, into the legal field to help seek justice and, and help hold these, you know, people accountable. Um, but at the same time, it is, you are entering this, uh, this treacherous kind of swamp. Um, and a lot of people don't wanna have to deal with that. Um, I'm glad to not live too close to DC right now, but I did, uh, you know, I went to college at the University of Maryland right outside DC when Obama was president. And I loved, uh, that atmosphere, uh, being there during the Obama years. Um, and I'm so glad I'm nowhere near there now, you know? Uh, but I'm, I'm gonna try to do what I can from afar. 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (20:33)
Um, I think the threat to, uh, you know, undocumented people and immigrants is super real. You know, Chris, I, I do think he's gonna act on some of those things. And I'm, I'm concerned for, you know, members of my community that are gonna be impacted. I'm, I think they're gonna try to take away reproductive whites even more. They're clearly, you know, making efforts on that front. And so there's so many things in addition to the, you know, the drug war, which I think is, you know, what we're focusing on. But they're all related. It's all about power, uh, at the end of the day, power and, and money . And, uh, and, and unfortunately, you know, compassion, uh, is not at the forefront like it should be. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (21:10)
Again, that was Lauren Mendelson, uh, Mickey Norris, you have something that you wanted to add? 

Mikki Norris: (21:14)
Yeah, I think the Republicans have lost their right to call themselves the, the party of law and Order at this point. I mean, they, they have lost a total respect, uh, of the law. They, they challenge it every step along the way, trying to move, uh, do judge shopping, do, you know, move things up if they don't like the, the result of a, you know, the ruling of the judge, they just, you know, keep bringing it back up. And hopefully, and I know Trump's counting on bringing it to the Supreme Court because they, he nominated a, you know, three of the justices that are there and feels like they're, you know, on his side. But I also think I'm, I'm concerned that this is become, we might be entering like another McCarthy era, you know, where, where he wants to bring prosecutions against his enemies, that they, you know, if they don't see things the way he does it, then they're enemies of the state. And, you know, that, that's very concerning to me. Where are we heading with, with all this? And are people gonna stand up? I, I, I think, uh, a lot of people will, I know that a lot of, in California here, we've got, you know, our Justice Department is gearing up for challenges along the way. And I think in other states they are too. So hopefully they'll hold them, you know, back or from all the terrible things that they're, they're hoping to achieve. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (22:49)
I, I wanna add this, that, uh, kind of tagging onto what Lauren was talking about, that the cartels are advancing. They are taking over more positions of authority right here in the United States. They are beginning to be, uh, the powers that be in some cases, or at least influencing the powers that be. And, and we have to realize this, that there, uh, as, as, as we keep giving them hundreds of billions of dollars, uh, to criminals around the world, every year, they use half of that money to bribe and control, uh, other authorities and, and move us closer and closer to where they can maintain their, their positions of power and, uh, make those billions. And we, we have to be aware that the, the, the dissolution, the, uh, diminishing of our rights gives more power to these cartels and the gangs to, uh, control our lives. And it's, it's, uh, it's, it's really sad that we can, that the, the power, our current powers that be, cannot see how this is beginning to take away their power and give it to criminals. Uh, Phil Smith, what do you have to say, sir? 

Phil Smith: (24:04)
Well, I think a slightly different angle on the cartels. I'm, I'm concerned about the cartels, but in regard to, uh, what the Trump administration may try to do about it, I mean, they've made that a huge issue during the, uh, the campaign, you know, even accused Canada of being a fentanyl importer, which is pretty ridiculous. Um, but, uh, in the, uh, in this last session of Congress, there were several bills coming out from Republican members about waging war in Mexico against the cartels. So I really have some concerns about whether we're gonna see some sort of, uh, wild, you know, military action in Mexico, um, with all the consequences that could have. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (24:45)
I don't know if it's a direct quote from Trump, but there was some discussion with him, I think, about lobbying missiles at the Cartel labs, uh, just taking it to that extreme 

Phil Smith: (24:58)
That could really destabilize, uh, relations on our southern border 

Reverend Dean Becker: (25:01)
Border. Yeah. But that's what he wants. He wants a war, he wants to be seen as a conqueror, as a, a dictator, as somebody who ruled things. And I, I think he, he would dig on that, I, to be honest. Um, and speaking of which, uh, uh, the New York Times has been doing some series, uh, a series on the situation with fentanyl in Mexico, and one of the stories talks about how do they test the fentanyl and what they do? Well, I, I've seen some pictures. They, they actually toured, uh, they were given permission by one of these cartel manufacturers to tour the lab to, um, come in and spend a, a a, a short time before they heard the police were coming. But again, that's part of the, their mechanism. The cartels have, you know, ears everywhere, and they know what's happening. But what they do, they take the fentanyl, they go down to the local homeless camp, it says, who wants to try some? And they see if somebody wants to shoot up a, a bit of fentanyl and see what happens. And, uh, they even tested on chickens and rabbits, uh, to, to see if it'll kill them. Uh, they wanna get somewhere in between killing rabbits and I guess keeping humans alive. But, uh, that's the quality control that the US government demands that we have in this drug war. Uh, any response there, please? 

Mikki Norris: (26:24)
Is that the DEA that's doing this, or is it 

Reverend Dean Becker: (26:28)
No, that, that was the d that was the New York Times that was reporting on the actual development of chemicals by cartel, uh, chemists and what they do with it to test it, how they determine Oh, yeah. Right. Worthy of selling to Americans. 

Mikki Norris: (26:43)
Okay. Well, I was kinda hoping to bring in the DEA anyway, , whether or not it was them doing it. But, um, there is a wonderful article in Reason Magazine about, um, the failure of the DEA and if Doge is gonna recommend a, uh, a department to cut, that would be a good place to, to start, because the DEA has failed in every measure of controlling the drug war. There've been more drugs, it, it, it related to mass incarceration. It, it hasn't achieved anything that it, that it's set out to do and made a lot of situations worse. So, absolutely, I'd be in favor of that cut, personally. 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (27:30)
Right. And we already have the Food and Drug Administration, so it's not like we don't have another agency that could be, you know, beefed up to provide some additional drug related oversight or just, hell just, you know, enforce what they have, uh, without the criminalization, uh, you know, kind of aspect that is permeated in the DEA, um, yeah, I would love to see them gone. 

Chris Conrad: (27:52)
And also, you've got the fact that they, once again, now they're suddenly, I shouldn't say suddenly, predictably, they're stalling the, uh, rescheduling hearings, you know, which, uh, there was a lot of pressure on 'em, and then it turned out they were having secret meetings with Sam. I, Phil, you might have more information on that, but, uh, my understanding is they were having secret meetings with Kevin Sette and, uh, our FK juniors, uh, group called Sam, that's RFK Jr. Right. Who was part of that. Mm-hmm . Maybe correct me, there was some Kennedy who was involved with Sam. 

Phil Smith: (28:21)
Yeah. I don't think it was 

Mikki Norris: (28:22)
Jr. I think it was Patrick. Yeah. 

Chris Conrad: (28:25)
Okay. Well, anybody, in any case, they were having been having secret meetings with this anti-marijuana group, Sam, and then they, uh, then they started, they weren't have this hearing where they were not inviting the cannabis advocates or the scientific community into it. Right. Then that got exposed, and now they've got this where they're just pushing it up until after the, uh, uh, beginning of next year, which, you know, which of course, they says to me, this is what happened when Francis Young, in 1988 ruled that marijuana was not scheduled properly. Uh, and then the appeals court said, well, was up to DEA to decide when to reschedule it. And so that's, how many years ago was that? , somebody able to do some math on that. But, uh, it's been a long time since 88, 36, 36 

Reverend Dean Becker: (29:03)
Years, he called it the, uh, most therapeutic agent known to man. I think if I'm, I'm close to the right quote there mm-hmm . And 

Chris Conrad: (29:11)
It's safe to say up really fast, uh, therapeutically active. That's just not a man. Yeah, yeah. 

Phil Smith: (29:16)
Yeah. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (29:17)
And 

Phil Smith: (29:18)
It seems like Washington DC is where marijuana reform goes to die anymore. I mean, I thought we would see legal marijuana out of Congress in the last couple of years mm-hmm . And it just did not happen. And I can't see it happening in the next couple of years either. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (29:33)
And let me throw in a a little quick story. Last year, our DA here in Houston had a, a, a, a meeting at her office. He brought, she invited the head of the DEA, the, the Haida, uh, for this area to speak. They were there to tell us there's fentanyl in the drugs, and, you know, as if we didn't know. But the whole point is the guy who showed up, I asked him, uh, will you come on my radio show? And he said, Mr. Becker, I'll come on your radio show the following Monday. I send a list of questions the Tuesday. They said, we'll, never come on your radio show. And that is an example of, I've done way over 10,000 radio shows inviting these same people, administrators of D-E-A-F-D-A-F-B-I, uh, any major cop, any politician, anybody with authority to come on my show and clarify for us the need for this drug war. What is the benefit? The DEA gets $3.2 billion a year to fall on its face and grind on the sidewalk. They, they have failed miserably. They are, they need to be done away with as, uh, Mickey said, uh, and, and we need to stop being cowards. We need to challenge these people every day, every way we can. They cannot defend this drug war they need to run for, well, they need to run from everybody. Like they run from me. Uh, responses, please. Mickey? 

Mikki Norris: (30:58)
Oh, no. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (31:00)
Oh, no. Okay. 

Mikki Norris: (31:02)
. Well, yeah, I, the DEA, uh, if I didn't mention this before, yeah. And drugs are more available. They're cheaper, they're more dangerous. I mean, as a result of a lot of the DEA actions and, and the way we've conducted this drug war. So, you know, we've known, we've been involved in this issue since the late eighties, and already since that time, we've already known and, and public opinion has felt that the, the drug wars failed. And, you know, it wasn't meant to go on this long. I don't think, uh, unless it was like the prison industrial complexes and the whole drug war industrial complex that, that keeps perpetuating and finding new reasons to carry it on so that they can, you know, have their jobs and, and get their money. But, you know, everybody knows it's failed. We need to bring an end to this war, the longest war that we've ever had, actually. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (32:01)
Oh, 

Chris Bennett: (32:02)
That's, you know, here in Canada where we've legalized, you know, all the concerns of all the prohibitionists and everything they said has failed to manifest cannabis has been completely normalized. I go into the liquor store here, government run liquor store here, and I buy cannabis off a little old lady i, I order from online companies. And another little old lady, uh, comes and delivers it to my home. It's completely normalized. And none, you don't see any news stories about all the problems that legalization is causing and the, the, the, the, the incredible addicts, you know, and, uh, going back to what Lauren said, uh, earlier about the youth, I, I write that, that that turnover in the youth there, uh, completely to like, uh, uh, podcasts like Joe Rogan, uh, uh, Andrew Tates, uh, Jordan Peterson's, uh, um, these, they, they, they've been working for years. 

Chris Bennett: (32:53)
And people in the mainstream media didn't realize how effective and popular these podcasts were. You know what I mean? Uh, Rogan had basically laid the red carpet out for fascism with his, his, his, uh, uh, gum job interview with Trump. And so it's not really surprising. And what's more surprising to me is that, you know, and probably Chris and Mickey can relate to this, is the amount of long time marijuana activists that we worked alongside with our friends and Conrads that flipped over to Maga. Uh, um, it's been one of the most heartbreaking things that I've experienced. I is seeing that and witnessing that and trying to understand that. And, uh, I disagree with Laura in, in regard to trying to open up avenues to correspondence, because I just don't see it. It's like anytime you open up the avenue to these people, all you do is open up your yourself to a bunch of gaslighting and stuff. It's like, I, I, I hate to say it, but I've never really seen anybody come back from mega, and I, I really don't know how to address that and deal with it. It's kind of made me feel hopeless in a lot of ways. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (33:54)
Well, I mag 

Chris Conrad: (33:57)
Can I, can I jump in for a second here though? Because, you know, we're, we're talking about the whole, uh, first off, I, I, I agree with you. I, it, it was quite depressing, Chris, to see what was going on with these people. And frankly, a lot of that has to do with Obama's big crackdown on medical marijuana in 2010. I think that that turned people against the Democrats turned a lot of the marijuana community against, and it made 'em so that when Kamala Harris, even though she had in introduced the legalization bill, they said, well, you can't trust the Democrats. We thought Obama's gonna do it. And instead we had rates. So I, I think it's hard to overstate the amount of damage that Obama has, uh, justice Department did by launching those raids where they arrested more people in one year than Trump had. 

Chris Conrad: (34:36)
Re I mean, excuse me. Then Bush Jr had arrested in, uh, eight years as President. Uh, and the other thing I, I'm thinking about this whole thing back to what you're talking about, um, Dean, about getting away with stuff. I think it's really important right now for people to call the White House two oh two four five six one one one. I'll repeat that number, 2 0 2 4 5 6 1 1 1 1, and ask or demand that they release and redact all the files related to investigations of Donald Trump in terms of Russia, in terms of all the various corrupt corruptions things. Because we know for sure that when the FBI raided Jeffrey Epstein's office, he had a safe in which there were files about Trump and other Republicans and political powers that, uh, had videos, according to what I, the reports that Epstein himself claimed to have founds of about politicians. And then that all disappeared when the FBI raid his house. 

Chris Conrad: (35:29)
And none of that has shown up again. So that means we've got two categories. We've got information that is, some people are benefiting from it being hidden, and we have other information that's probably being used to blackmail politicians right now that is in the hand of, we don't even know who. And so I, I think it's, it's important, at least for history, that future generations will be able to look back and find out what really happened under Trump. Because if we otherwise, I think he's just gonna, like, have those records destroyed, and he's gonna create a completely manufactured narrative. And then we're never going to get Justice 

Reverend Dean Becker: (35:59)
Echoes of j Edgar Hoover. I think there that, uh, he, he had files on a lot of politicians and blackmailed and control them as well. Uh, Mickey your thoughts? Yeah. 

Mikki Norris: (36:10)
As long as you're gonna call the White House, why don't you call, uh, let Biden know it's time to issue the rest of the pardons he needs to issue and let the marijuana prisoners go, the nonviolent marijuana prisoners, there's still people sitting there serving decades long sentences. There's still people who are doing, you know, who are charged and convicted of things that are legal now in the most, a lot of the states. So, um, a way to start ending this drug war would be to let the marijuana prisoners go out of the federal prisons and follow it up with the, you know, with the states as well. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (36:54)
You know, the, the first story we talked about the, um, 16-year-old getting four bullets to the chest that was in Alabama, and I don't know who is further in the past, Alabama or Texas, my state is now wanting to re uh, um, control THC in any form, whether it comes from hemp or whatever, can't have THC in this, this state 'cause of, well, the primitive attitudes of, uh, our governor and lieutenant Governor, who, again, this reminds me of, I am sure that those many politicians get elected from cartel money, money donated laundered and, and sent through car dealerships or whoever. But in order to compel or demand or, uh, ask these politicians to hang onto the drug war, because, uh, the, that's just another means to bribe, uh, and maintain their control over this illegal and deadly supply. I, it is hard to prove, but I I have no doubt it's happening. I, I just don't trust, uh, politicians or the cartels, they all lie. That's what they do for a living. Uh, 

Chris Conrad: (38:07)
You don't even trust the cartels . 

Reverend Dean Becker: (38:12)
Well, no, I don't. But, but the whole point being, yeah, they all just lie to maintain, to keep this charade going. And it is nothing but a charade. What is the benefit? What have we ever gotten from this drug war? What did we get that benefited society, made mankind thrive? There has never been anything. And yet they, they lie to us on a daily basis. Every one of them. I, I, 

Chris Conrad: (38:38)
And, and I would say to some extent, they're using that in the, the CBD and THC, uh, the Delta A THC and stuff as ways of suppressing industrial hemp because, uh, essentially the farmers, when we've got industrial hemp legalized, uh, for cultivation by Obama, and then a can really hemp, uh, legalized under Trump. Uh, initially the, the research was all going into, like, we are in California, we've got the water shortages, we've got earthquakes, we've got fires. All these things that Hemp Creek could be used to solve if it was part of our housing. But instead of that, uh, everything jumped into oh CBD, and oh, now they can't tell marijuana from CBD and cannaboid hemp. And it changed this whole narrative around, and it also changed the investment in hemp away from the positive environmental benefits that, and economic benefits that we were anticipating, and turned it instead into this fight over, can you sell, uh, THC that's been derived from hemp at gas stations or not, is now the discussion about hemp. 

Chris Conrad: (39:36)
And so, you know, I I think there, there's kind of a, uh, a subtle way that, and, and I, I, I, I think the media's responsible for so much of this stuff just because they'll, they'll suck on any, anything that the drug war puts out. Like, oh, we've got cops who are now getting addicted by touching empty bags that used to have, uh, methamphetamine and stuff. And the news people will actually, you know, feed on that for, for a long time, but they won't really follow up on, uh, how hemp can help the environment and, and you know, about the infrastructure for hemp and so forth. And so, you know, I think this is an unfortunate twist to the whole thing too. The media and they're chasing after the squirrels doesn't damage all, all through the whole system, not just, uh, only on the drug war, but all these peripheral issues. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (40:17)
A hundred years ago, William Randolph Hurst and his newspapers spread the information that frightened America into believing that these marijuana laws were necessary. And it's still going on. The Washington Post is still trying to find ways they're publishing stories last week, week before that, uh, shows, well, marijuana might be more dangerous now, it might be more addictive. Your kids might fall into the pit and then be absorbed. You know, it's, it's just the same old reform madness is still being recycled to this day. 

Chris Conrad: (40:46)
And it shows you the advantage of why you should write letters to the editor. 'cause they did that in our paper here. And I wrote, uh, a piece saying, they said, it's not your grandfather's marijuana. I said, well, you don't drive your grandfather's car. You don't use your grandfather's phone. Your grandfather didn't even have a computer. So why? What's the problem with that? You know, nothing, we, we don't use our grandfather's anything. But when it comes to marijuana, oh, every grandfather's making, 

Mikki Norris: (41:06)
And yet reports now are showing that youth use rates of, of marijuana use has gone down at an all time low. And as at the same time when we're getting more and more states to legalize it. So maybe there's a correlation somehow or another between legal marijuana and, and the youth losing some interest in it. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (41:31)
Well, I've written often that it is the prohibition itself, which encourages, it motivates people to get into the trade. It. If, if you can buy a pound and sell ounces and, and pay your rent, well, a lot of people do that. And it's the same with, uh, if a pound of cocaine, uh, $2,000 in Columbia and $200,000 in Australia. So there, there's always this motivation for people to get on board this gravy train. This is the gravy train that the, the feds and the politicians created. They, it's a lure, it's a temptation to our children to get involved. And they can't seem to realize that, 

Chris Bennett: (42:14)
You know, when the last, uh, time he was President Trump was, uh, uh, blaming the mass shootings on, on marijuana use. But, uh, I don't know that that, that they're gonna be totally, I'm, you know, totally anti-Trump, don't me wrong. But I don't know that this administration's gonna be totally negative. It's really hard to call. You know, you have people like Bezos, uh, uh, whose pro legal, you know, decriminalization anyways, uh, uh, he was on the Rogan Show, Rogan's, uh, pretty, you know, adv advocates for marijuana use and smokes it on every show. I don't think he did on that one. I think it was nuts talking that. And, uh, uh, um, so, you know, there's a lot of people in pro-Trump, people that are pro legalization at the same time. There's a lot of, uh, lobbying from the private prison industry and stuff like that, which, you know, fed a lot on marijuana prohibition. Uh, um, but it's, yeah, we're, it remains to be seen what they're gonna do in this regard. And, you know, have did, I didn't, I think Trump did do some favorable stuff for him when he was, uh, president as well. 

Mikki Norris: (43:12)
Yeah. And after going after Hunter Biden for his lying on the, the form about, uh, not, not using drugs. When, when you're buying a gun and you think that the gun lobbyists and all the people, the go pro gun rights people would be in favor of changing that. Where are they on this? 

Chris Conrad: (43:36)
But they stand up for the right of the automatic weapons for shooters. And they, and the parents who give their kids automatic weapons, that's all key. But our, uh, but Hunter Biden didn't, didn't fill out one of the questions on his form. Right? So, sure. You know, that's, that's a monstrosity. And to me, this all points out why it's important for people to listen to programs like yours, Dean here, uh, and, and cultural baggage, and to read, uh, drug War Chronicles and, and our publication of leaf online.com. Because if you're relying upon the mainstream media or the right wing blogs here or podcast to tell you the truth, you're not gonna be satisfied. You're not gonna get the truth. You can only live delusions. And so it's really important that there's a few of us media sources out there, and I would add alternate in the daily costs and a few other things to that, where you can still get real news. Uh, but I don't think you can count on the mainstream news for, for the real news very much anymore. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (44:30)
I, I have to agree at that same meeting where the DEA head, um, stated, Mr. Becker, I come on your show. There was A-B-C-N-B-C and CBS had their cameras filming him hit to the six o'clock and 10 o'clock news that same night. And I talked to each of them. I said, look, if you ever want to hear some other side of this besides this album, you get from the DEA, please call on me. I gave them my business card, and of course, they didn't call on me. They never have. I don't think they ever will, because they are on the other side. They are caught. They are part of the conspiracy, the means to maintain and, uh, profit from this every time. They, they show a picture of a table full of drugs and guns and, and money. They get, they, the, the people support them. They support the DEA or the local cops. It's all a, uh, a mutual advantageous and mutual absolution I was talking about. It's a means to meet their mortgage payment, and there's no other benefit to it for anyone on this planet. Uh, we're nearing the end here. Uh, Chris, you, you mentioned your website. I want to go around the, uh, the, the panel here. Um, the, the leaf, uh, explain again, your, your site, uh, Chris Conrad, I 

Chris Conrad: (45:43)
Think the leaf online.com is, uh, the website that, uh, we have cannabis news on, and we might be expanding the way things are going right now. Uh, also chris conrad.com is where you can get more information about me, and I'm a ex cannabis expert witness who's worked on thousands of court cases. So, um, you know, I'm always interested in looking what people's legal problems are, and I just wanna throw out an RIP to Jimmy Carter, uh, only president to step forward and ask Congress to, uh, decriminalize marijuana. And, uh, you know, he just lost him at a hundred years old, and he was truly, uh, I think one of the greatest people to be president. Whether he was the greatest president or not, is arguable, but whether I think he was really as a human being, a really great human being. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (46:22)
I agree with that a hundred percent. Thank you for bringing up Jimmy. I, I, I respect the man. Uh, but let's go start with Phil. Uh, your, your website. What would you like to share? 

Phil Smith: (46:30)
Yeah, it's not the drug award.org, the drug award Chronicle been doing that for 25 years now. Um, would like to retire, but, uh, they keep me busy. So, uh, check us out. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (46:44)
Alright. And, uh, uh, Mickey, uh, is there a separate site you want to, uh, recommend? 

Mikki Norris: (46:49)
There's not a separate site, but I would like to invite the, the listeners to come to California. A great state. We're making some progress here. Um, in the new year, we're gonna be starting to allow, uh, cannabis lounges, like coffee shop style, uh, like Amsterdam, coffee shop style, uh, places for people to go and buy and consume their cannabis and get a, a cappuccino like, like they do in Amsterdam. Uh, it's gonna be slowly coming on board, but it's, it, it's going to be changing. So we're optimistic here. So come to California. It's a great state. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (47:31)
Alright, uh, now we're moving to Mr. Chris Bennett, uh, your, your site. What would you like to recommend? 

Chris Bennett: (47:36)
Uh, I don't have any, uh, uh, website these days. If you search my name in cannabis, you'll find lots of interviews and articles and that sort of stuff kind of says where I'm at. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (47:44)
Alright. And, uh, you've written many books, uh, about, uh, cannabis. Yeah, yeah. 

Chris Bennett: (47:48)
I've written a lot of books on the history of cannabis, uh, and mostly in ancient religion and magic and that sort of thing. Uh, um, you can find those on Amazon and, uh, yeah, no, I, you know, as, as much as I've lost faith in politics and people, I still have regained my faith in cannabis. It's a beautiful plant and cannabis is doing what it can to save the planet every day. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (48:08)
All right. And Lauren Mendelson, uh, your thoughts please? 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (48:11)
Absolutely. Thanks for having me on. Um, I am, uh, so I'm a, a lawyer at the law office of Omar Figueroa, and our website is omar figueroa.com. Uh, we're cannabis compliance, uh, kind of experts in California. Um, but I'm also on the board of California normal. Uh, and you can look up California normal and check out all of the very, uh, great work that organization, uh, is doing. And, um, again, thanks for having me. I hope to be on, uh, another time and we can continue having some really deep discussions about all this. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (48:42)
I, I look more, I look forward to it. Lauren and I, I looked at my timer. We started a bit late, so we have a few minutes, and I wanna bring up a subject again. I, I mentioned I'm in Texas, uh, now hemp, THC is legal, THCA. And I don't know, I, I can't smoke so much any, I smoke, excuse me, smoke too many Marlboros as a kid, and it's just hard for me to smoke anything these days. But I, I'm wondering, in California, you know, Mickey, you're talking about gonna have the, uh, the, the cafes, et cetera, which is wonderful. Uh, but I, I wanted to ask, uh, in California, Oregon, uh, Canada, uh, is weed really legal or are, are people still getting busted? Uh, their, their children were too near a supply or, uh, there was in a car or there was too much of a round or, uh, uh, are there still laws against the plant, or can you just grow it in your front yard and nobody cares? 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (49:37)
I'll, I'll take California. It's not like treated like a tomato where you can grow it in the front. Like anyone cares. There's still limits on how much you can grow, where you can grow it, kinda what you can do with it. Um, and, uh, and yeah, there's still criminal offenses on the books if you don't, uh, comply with that. So it's not the full, I think, legalization that many folks thought of. It's also, while easier than in some states to get a license and operate a cannabis business, it still has many, uh, obstacles. And it's, uh, accessing that is not something that is easy for everyone or doable based on where your county or town you live in might not even be an option there because of local control. And so, um, there's, uh, a lot of folks that are looking to maybe pass another initiative or, or do some serious work on, on Prop 64. 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (50:26)
We've got taxes going up. The excess tax is about to go up to 19% on top of the local taxes. Um, and that's just gonna further drive people out of the legal market and into the illicit market. And so there's a lot of conversations about how we're gonna restructure the, the taxes because the, um, a lot of people aren't gonna vote, uh, in a, you know, other stakeholders won't vote for proposal that's gonna result in less taxes for the state because there's other programs now that depend on these taxes. Uh, and so it's like a very complicated problem to solve. But right now we're seeing, uh, just a, a relatively low participation in the legal industry here, um, in comparison to some other states. And when you take the, you know, the history into account, and I think a lot of that has to do with these high taxes that hopefully we figure out something about, uh, and just the, uh, relative kind of lack of access to licenses. So we'll see. There's a new license type that the state's about to roll out, and January 1st, a combined activities license. Um, and there's, uh, that could help in addition to the, the food at lounges that, that Mickey was mentioning. So, uh, there's definitely some, been some growing pains here. Uh, and that's why the fight's not quite over it'ss not really fully legal yet. We'll keep fighting for it. 

Chris Conrad: (51:39)
And if I could follow up on that, I would say that for the individual adult, it is definitely legal. You can possess it, you're not gonna have a problem. You can smell like weed, it's not gonna be a problem. You can grow it in your backyard, it's not gonna be a problem. You can give it away to your friends, it's not gonna be a problem. But once you sell it, you've entered into a whole nother realm. It used to be, uh, like, you know, a year of a, a year to three years in prison and a fine up to $10,000. Now they can, they'll, they won't charge you with, uh, illegal under the, under the, uh, criminal statute of, of marijuana. 'cause that's still the same. What they'll do is they go for the simple thing and they say, you're operating a marijuana business without a license and you're not filing all the rules for marijuana businesses. And then they start filing. And I've seen people with $3 million in fines assessed. 

Lauren Mendelsohn: (52:20)
Yeah. And taxes, they'll, they'll charge you the, the taxes as though you were doing it legally. And so you get the fines and then you get this massive tax bill. Um, I've seen that too. And so, yeah. 

Chris Conrad: (52:31)
Yeah. So they just shifted it over to civil court, and in some ways it's worse because of these, these massive bills, and then they start taking people's property, uh, you know, but they're not going to jail. But they might take your, all your commercial buildings, right. 

Chris Bennett: (52:43)
You know, in Canada it's regulated, you know, uh, but, you know, everybody can grow four plants. Uh, I can't think of anybody that I know that's been busted for driving or growing since. And even, you know, I bought, I, I bought cannabis once or twice, uh, through the legal avenues. I bought buy most of it off online websites and stuff that are completely illegal and operate pretty much freely. And, and this is pretty widely spread. I was surprised in the little town I live here in Nova Scotia, uh, uh, the mail strike was, was going on, so I couldn't order for my normal order. I looked up and there was like half a dozen delivery places in the little town that I was at, and I was able to like, just call up somebody and get cannabis, cannabis delivered right to my door here, uh, with no, no trouble. So it's, it's, you know, about as legal as you're gonna get. I think, you know, some activists dream where they can grow it in their backyard and sell it out of their front yard, but that's just unrealistic, uh, uh, as a first step. And, uh, it's working in Canada. Man, you know what we got here right now, it's working. And, uh, the, the corporation has tried to take it over. That didn't work. That's fallen apart for 'em. It's like, uh, that become more and more of a grassroots industry every day. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (53:52)
Thank you all. Uh, I want to, um, give the last, uh, me message to Phil. I know that Oregon tried legalizing all, uh, dec criming, which is the drug lord's dream fulfilled, but, uh, it didn't work out. But I know that people up there get busted with huge, uh, fields and, uh, get some sort of fine, but I don't think the millions of dollars that Chris was talking about. Uh, uh, give us a minute there, Phil. What's, what's it like in Oregon? 

Phil Smith: (54:19)
Well, it's legal in Oregon, but there are people that get busted for growing large amounts and sending it to United States like Texas, that, that remains a crime under state law. Um, but other than that, we have dispensaries everywhere. Uh, you know, if you have the means, you can grow your own. That's what I do. I never set foot in a dispensary. I'm just smoking my own product all year. Um, yeah, it's not the tomato model. That tomato model may be ideal, but we're not there. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (54:48)
All right. Well, uh, uh, once again, I, I want to thank Mr. Phil Smith. Mr. Chris Conrad. Uh, Sam Azar joined us here late. I might've seen you late. Sorry, Sam. Uh, Lauren Mendelson, thank you very much. We will do more shows. Uh, Chris Conrad. We of course will do more. You and Mickey both know that, and I want to thank you all. Alright. To close out the show and help us transition to the new year, I present the words of Roger Goodman. He's a representative for the state of Washington. 

Rep Roger Goodman : (55:19)
Yeah. Our drug policies over the last century are, uh, exhibit one of fascism and what I said before, where our system is based on greed and racism and fear. If anything, our drug policies have been based on greed, racism, and fear for the last a hundred years. And the, I'd say the best worst example of, of fascism. And so I hope, uh, uh, although there are worrisome trends that the drug war might be cranked up again, but I hope that we're seeing, uh, uh, the end of the drug war eventually. But right now it's a little bump of the road. 

Reverend Dean Becker: (55:54)
Yeah. Uh, well, and the heck of it is, well, in the last month, Trump has said that, uh, he wants to follow in on the heels of China and, uh, arrest drug users, uh, try them quickly and then execute them quickly. And yeah, 

Rep Roger Goodman : (56:09)
I, I, I mean, you know, that's, that's bluster. Uh, we do have a court system that functions, at least for the moment. But, uh, I am concerned about the people in states voting against, in this last election, a number of progressive drug policy measures related to cannabis, related to psychedelics. Uh, most of them failed. And so we are seeing a retrenchment now, uh, into these, uh, uh, I guess I said it as part of our interview just now, like, we are a democracy. We got what he, what we deserve. You know, 

Reverend Dean Becker: (56:39)
Part of it is even him being elected, that disturbs me, scares me, but I I know it's, it's living in a country where that many people prefer fascism. Right? And that's, that's all Hitler needed. And, and once it's rolling, nobody's gonna stand in the way and stop Sea Island. They're gonna just do it to all the Drug Truth Network listeners out there. I wanna wish you a very safe and happy New Year. Take care of yourself. The government don't give up nothing. And I wanna encourage you, I wanna kick you in the butt this coming year, become more of a citizen. Do your part, help to end this stupidity. And again, I remind you that because of prohibition, you don't know what's in that bag. I urge you to please be careful and remember that euphoria is a blessing, not a crime. As the Reverend Most High, I consider it my job to teach you the choir to sing solos. We bring you the complete unvarnished truth about the drug war and find there is no one in law enforcement willing, daring to attempt to refute what we present here. Please help to expose the abomination of this drug war. Until next time, this is Dean Becker, the Reverend Most High claiming the moral high ground, DEA Agent Cuomo, I'll come on your show.